John 17

[TrevorL]

Greetings again Pipripi,

You can stand wherever you wants Trevor, but remember that you have called Jesus a liar.

I am surprised and very disappointed by this statement, as it is such a serious accusation, so let us sort this out first. I assume this is based upon the end of your previous post based upon my comment on "mansions" John 14:2.

The faithful are now part of the Father's house, and there are no mansions in heaven.

Are you calling Jesus a liar? And also John!! Where is Jesus now? Where is Jehovah God now? John 14:1-3!! Are you crazy!!
Thank you Lord to let those that read what Trevor said against you, he is a false teacher.

I suggest that you have a wrong assessment of John 14:2. I do not see the need to say much more about your false accusation, except to say I hope others weigh this matter correctly.

Again following what people think inplace what the Bible says.
Which person is your teacher: The margin of RV, or John? John 5:1-3.

Could I ask whether the "remnant SDAs" are KJVO proponents? Not sure why you quoted John 5:1-3 - please explain.

No not true. Your hypnotized mind cannot be opened anymore. Because you continue to mixed worldly things with spiritual things.

Nothing worldly about considering that Jesus is God's house and the faithful are part of this. I suggest that you interpret spiritual or figurative concepts by literal ideas. You seem to suggest that there is a literal tabernacle in heaven similar to the tabernacle in the wilderness, and somehow in this "house" there are many "mansions".

Jesus could NOT be a house, neither literally or spiritually!! So this is nonsense.

The faithful doesn't have now any place in this spiritual house of God. Because Jesus didn't come yet to changed their physical body to spiritual bodies. The Jerusalem in heaven maybe have just some person in it. Nobody knows.

You have made these two statements on either side of my quotation and comments on Hebrews 3:1-6 which clearly support my understanding and rejects your statements.

I have answered all your questions, but everybody knows now that you have loose this debate. And cannot answered all of my questions.
You have calling Jesus a liar!

See above. Now you put the accusation in bold, and raise your eyebrow!!

John 12:23–28 (KJV): 23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. 25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. 26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour. 27 Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. 28 Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.
I decided to add the above reference because it is a further step in understanding what Jesus states about going to the Father. Jesus was in perfect fellowship with his father, God, the Father, but his approaching crucifixion was part of the Way to the Father. So Jesus was in perfect fellowship "where I am" but he needed to become the perfect sacrifice in order to go to the Father. I consider the same phrase in John 14 is using this concept.
John 14:1–4 (KJV): 1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. 2 In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. 4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
This is speaking about a spiritual status in the spiritual house,

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Pipiripi]

You said you will write something more so that i can find can find it .I am waiting for your response to the use of the word seven churches.

Do you have go to my seven churches thread?

Heavenly eternal things not seen must be mixed with the temporal seen according to the prescription of faith ( 2 Corinthians 4:18) then we can find the gospel mystery hid from natural man .

No, not at all. Search what is from above has nothing to do with things from this earth. And there is no mystery in God's word. God doesn't let us in doubt.

2Corinthians 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost

And it is also no mystery. And if it is a mystery, is because 2 Thessalonians 2:8-12 has completed in your life. You cannot see the truth anymore.

2Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

That's mean those that believe that Jesus Christ come rule in this earthly Jerusalem and fight against Satan, now by His second coming, are focusing at the things temporal of this world.

No mixing, no gospel or sabbath rest when yoked with Christ

Go ask those that rest in Jesus and saying that Jesus is their Sabbath rest. If you are also one of them, you can defend your self. But is it not, let their god holy spirit fighting for them.

Hebrews 4;1-2King James Version Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

Stop plucking verses and read the whole context. This is exactly what you are doing. The same as the Israelites in the past. Ignoring to read the whole context in the Bible, and plucking verses here and there and building your own destruction, and call it rest in Jesus Christ. Jesus rest is our Sabbath!! And by the end of this world, you will find yourself in hell fire.

Not mixing faith the seven churches is taken literally or what the eyes see, the temporal caled the measure of men and not the golden measure of faith spoken of in parables

I told you once and for all! The book of Revelation is not a parable book. But a book full with symbolically language. Again you with your world brain and nothing of spiritual mind, are plucking verses here and there, just because the letter 7.
My friend seven means nothing in this issue.

 

[Pipiripi]

Greetings again Pipripi,

I am surprised and very disappointed by this statement, as it is such a serious accusation, so let us sort this out first. I assume this is based upon the end of your previous post based upon my comment on "mansions" John 14:2

No, not only on your comment of mansion, but also that you disagree that Jesus telling his disciples that He is going to His Father, and then come back to take them in His Father house.

And also you you are saying many other things about John 14:1-3. I just write this three verses, why don't you have read the rest and see what Jesus has said with 2 disciples that has ask Him a question? Go read it and learn stop plucking verses.

I suggest that you have a wrong assessment of John 14:2. I do not see the need to say much more about your false accusation, except to say I hope others weigh this matter correctly.

No I don't have a wrong assessment of John 14:2, neither a wrong understanding. Why? Because I have understood the book of John completely and exactly how it is telling us to only believe in them. Go read John 17 again. Jesus has prayed for us (true Christian) that are listening to the apostles. Not other human beings.

Could I ask whether the "remnant SDAs" are KJVO proponents? Not sure why you quoted John 5:1-3 - please explain.

I don't know what is KJVO proponents! Trevor we are the rest of the true SDA Church of the pioneers. You cannot find us in any other churches that hold on the trinity doctrine, or Sunday god worship, and any of these fallen churches that cannot preached the three angels messages to the world today. And for you this all is already happend. But in reality you cannot understand the book of Revelation and Daniel. I think anyone!! Your teachings are not Biblical. Do you have found a place in your teaching to fit the no "sea" anymore?
First you said that Jesus are going to rule on earth in this earthly Jerusalem. Now that you have understand that there is no sea anymore, you are starting to changing your invented gospel, and talking about earthquake and the new Jerusalem come down in the place of the old! And so the confusion keep going on and on!!

John 5:1-3 has nothing to do with teaching about the new Jerusalem in heaven. It is just a day like us day that there was a religious feast, Jesus also has gone.
Start reading the Bible without your plucking verses books.

Nothing worldly about considering that Jesus is God's house and the faithful are part of this.

Yes completely nonsense. Jesus is God His SON. Not God house. God house is in heaven. Jesus said my Father house have many mansions. Where in the Bible I can read "Jesus is God house"? NONSENSE!!

I suggest that you interpret spiritual or figurative concepts by literal ideas.

No, not true my friend. I follow everything that is written in the Bible, without using anything out of the Bible first. Go read through my pages, and show me where you can find something that isn't in harmony with the Bible.

You seem to suggest that there is a literal tabernacle in heaven similar to the tabernacle in the wilderness, and somehow in this "house" there are many "mansions".

I am not suggesting. I know that it is so. Which on is original? The one that God told Moses to build on earth or the one in heaven is a copy?? Do you know what a copy is?

You have made these two statements on either side of my quotation and comments on Hebrews 3:1-6 which clearly support my understanding and rejects your statements.

Again! The same problem again and again and again!! Plucking verses because of the word "house" is now everybody bodies.

Let me help you again my friend. Moses was the leader of the people of Israel (house), waiting for Jesus to come (the owner of the house). So when the owner has come, He self has cleansed His house (us) with His own blood. This story has nothing to do with John 14:1-6.

See above. Now you put the accusation in bold, and raise your eyebrow!!

Because you are keeping pretending that you have the truth. But even that you self has read it from the Bible, you will never come to the Bible teachings alone . Why? Because of 2 Thessalonians 2:8-12 is uder your control. This is the sadness thing that can happen to ignorant people.

John 12:23–28 (KJV): 23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. 25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. 26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour. 27 Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. 28 Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.
I decided to add the above reference because it is a further step in understanding what Jesus states about going to the Father. Jesus was in perfect fellowship with his father, God, the Father, but his approaching crucifixion was part of the Way to the Father. So Jesus was in perfect fellowship "where I am" but he needed to become the perfect sacrifice in order to go to the Father. I consider the same phrase in John 14 is using this concept.

Your considering has closed your eyes to see the reality.
From where come a voice saying to Jesus Christ that He is already glorified?
Again mixing verses from another completely issue of a story, in another story far from each other. This two statements are not in accordance with each other my friend. Do you see what plucking verses has done to your brain my friend. We must accept exactly what is written in the Bible. Galatians 1:1-10. O! My God! Have mercy with me. All this is for those that can still be opened to receive your Holy Spirit. Not a god holy spirit.

John 14:1–4 (KJV): 1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. 2 In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. 4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
This is speaking about a spiritual status in the spiritual house,

Yes, and at the time that Jesus comes to take us with Him, then we that are still alive will changed from corruptible to incorruptible. 1 Corinthians 15:58. Read verse 52 good. And all this will happened when Jesus returns now.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again Pipripi,

No, not only on your comment of mansion, but also that you disagree that Jesus telling his disciples that He is going to His Father, and then come back to take them in His Father house.

I read John 14:1-3 as that first he went to the crucifixion to prepare a place in the Spiritual House for the disciples. After the crucifixion he would be raised from the dead and appear to them and they would believe on him, and thus be true members of the house of God.

And also you you are saying many other things about John 14:1-3. I just write this three verses, why don't you have read the rest and see what Jesus has said with 2 disciples that has ask Him a question? Go read it and learn stop plucking verses.

I have read and giving careful thought to the whole passage and context. I am not "plucking verses". Please also consider the verses immediately before John 14:1-3 and there is some indication of the events that were to happen including the crucifixion. I suggest that you may be plucking verses out of context:
John 13:31–33,36-38 (KJV): 31 Therefore, when he was gone out, Jesus said, Now is the Son of man glorified, and God is glorified in him. 32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him. 33 Little children, yet a little while I am with you. Ye shall seek me: and as I said unto the Jews, Whither I go, ye cannot come; so now I say to you.
36 Simon Peter said unto him, Lord, whither goest thou? Jesus answered him, Whither I go, thou canst not follow me now; but thou shalt follow me afterwards. 37 Peter said unto him, Lord, why cannot I follow thee now? I will lay down my life for thy sake. 38 Jesus answered him, Wilt thou lay down thy life for my sake? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, The cock shall not crow, till thou hast denied me thrice.

No I don't have a wrong assessment of John 14:2, neither a wrong understanding. Why? Because I have understood the book of John completely and exactly how it is telling us to only believe in them. Go read John 17 again. Jesus has prayed for us (true Christian) that are listening to the apostles. Not other human beings.

I suggest that your claim that you "have understood the book of John completely and exactly" is a vain boast. The claim that you are the "true Christians" which you claim are only the remnant Sabbath keepers and remnant SDAs is also a vain boast. Perhaps you should listen to what God said to Elijah about the 7000.

I don't know what is KJVO proponents!

I asked because you keep on insisting on the KJV "mansions" while other translations clarify the true meaning here. A KJVO are people that claim that the KJV is inspired and that all other translations are corrupt or erroneous.

You cannot find us in any other churches that hold on the trinity doctrine, or Sunday god worship, and any of these fallen churches that cannot preached the three angels messages to the world today. And for you this all is already happend. But in reality you cannot understand the book of Revelation and Daniel. I think anyone!! Your teachings are not Biblical.

Again your vain boast.

Do you have found a place in your teaching to fit the no "sea" anymore? First you said that Jesus are going to rule on earth in this earthly Jerusalem. Now that you have understand that there is no sea anymore, you are starting to changing your invented gospel, and talking about earthquake and the new Jerusalem come down in the place of the old! And so the confusion keep going on and on!!

The confusion is in your mind, not mine. Your test of my position is very shallow, and is based upon your own erroneous perspective.

John 5:1-3 has nothing to do with teaching about the new Jerusalem in heaven. It is just a day like us day that there was a religious feast, Jesus also has gone.
Start reading the Bible without your plucking verses books.

Vague. You have plucked John 5:1-3 and does not seem to make any sense or be relevant to this discussion.

Yes completely nonsense. Jesus is God His SON. Not God house. God house is in heaven. Jesus said my Father house have many mansions. Where in the Bible I can read "Jesus is God house"? NONSENSE!!

Please attempt to read and understand Hebrews 3:1-6.

No, not true my friend. I follow everything that is written in the Bible, without using anything out of the Bible first. Go read through my pages, and show me where you can find something that isn't in harmony with the Bible.

Just about every one of your posts in this thread are not in harmony with the Bible.

I am not suggesting. I know that it is so. Which on is original? The one that God told Moses to build on earth or the one in heaven is a copy?? Do you know what a copy is?

How many people and how many mansions would fit into the Tabernacle in the Wilderness if the Tabernacle is a pattern of the House in heaven? The Most Holy was 10 cubits by 10 cubits and 10 cubits high.

Again! The same problem again and again and again!! Plucking verses because of the word "house" is now everybody bodies.
Let me help you again my friend. Moses was the leader of the people of Israel (house), waiting for Jesus to come (the owner of the house). So when the owner has come, He self has cleansed His house (us) with His own blood. This story has nothing to do with John 14:1-6.

Yes, they are all part of the same subject and theme.

Because you are keeping pretending that you have the truth. But even that you self has read it from the Bible, you will never come to the Bible teachings alone . Why? Because of 2 Thessalonians 2:8-12 is uder your control. This is the sadness thing that can happen to ignorant people.

Again your vain boast.

Your considering has closed your eyes to see the reality. From where come a voice saying to Jesus Christ that He is already glorified?

Perhaps you should reconsider John 12 despite your claim that you fully understand John's Gospel record.

Again mixing verses from another completely issue of a story, in another story far from each other. This two statements are not in accordance with each other my friend. Do you see what plucking verses has done to your brain my friend. We must accept exactly what is written in the Bible. Galatians 1:1-10. O! My God! Have mercy with me. All this is for those that can still be opened to receive your Holy Spirit. Not a god holy spirit.

???

Yes, and at the time that Jesus comes to take us with Him, then we that are still alive will changed from corruptible to incorruptible. 1 Corinthians 15:58. Read verse 52 good. And all this will happened when Jesus returns now.

This does not teach that Jesus is going to take us to heaven.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Pipiripi]

Greetings again Pipripi,

I read John 14:1-3 as that first he went to the crucifixion to prepare a place in the Spiritual House for the disciples.

Hi Trevor! It is not true! The crucifixion is for the sin of the whole world. And what you called spiritual house is not our bodies. And also it is not in this world. The spiritual house is in heaven where God lives. Someone has shown you once already that God doesn't live in house made by man. Jerusalem is a city with the temple of God into it in this world. Let me rewind your mind to see what how to describe the house of God. Burn your plucking verses book my friend. There is still hope!!

Genesis 28:17; 2 Chronicles 6:18; 1 Kings 8:27; 2 Corinthians 5:1.

Do you have read 2 Corinthians 5:1 before? I think not otherwise you will understand what it means. Do you see what plucking verses did with your brains ? Destroying!!

After the crucifixion he would be raised from the dead and appear to them and they would believe on him, and thus be true members of the house of God.

I have read and giving careful thought to the whole passage and context. I am not "plucking verses". Please also consider the verses immediately before John 14:1-3 and there is some indication of the events that were to happen including the crucifixion. I suggest that you may be plucking verses out of context:
John 13:31–33,36-38 (KJV): 31 Therefore, when he was gone out, Jesus said, Now is the Son of man glorified, and God is glorified in him. 32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him. 33 Little children, yet a little while I am with you. Ye shall seek me: and as I said unto the Jews, Whither I go, ye cannot come; so now I say to you.
36 Simon Peter said unto him, Lord, whither goest thou? Jesus answered him, Whither I go, thou canst not follow me now; but thou shalt follow me afterwards. 37 Peter said unto him, Lord, why cannot I follow thee now? I will lay down my life for thy sake. 38 Jesus answered him, Wilt thou lay down thy life for my sake? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, The cock shall not crow, till thou hast denied me thrice.

I suggest that your claim that you "have understood the book of John completely and exactly" is a vain boast. The claim that you are the "true Christians" which you claim are only the remnant Sabbath keepers and remnant SDAs is also a vain boast. Perhaps you should listen to what God said to Elijah about the 7000.

Yes! I know because Elijah is a coward. Just as you are when the true come you are running and tried to fix your wrong understanding. I am just as Elisha.

I asked because you keep on insisting on the KJV "mansions" while other translations clarify the true meaning here. A KJVO are people that claim that the KJV is inspired and that all other translations are corrupt or erroneous.

Again your vain boast.

The confusion is in your mind, not mine. Your test of my position is very shallow, and is based upon your own erroneous perspective.

Vague. You have plucked John 5:1-3 and does not seem to make any sense or be relevant to this discussion.

Please attempt to read and understand Hebrews 3:1-6.

Just about every one of your posts in this thread are not in harmony with the Bible.

How many people and how many mansions would fit into the Tabernacle in the Wilderness if the Tabernacle is a pattern of the House in heaven? The Most Holy was 10 cubits by 10 cubits and 10 cubits high.

Yes, they are all part of the same subject and theme.

Again your vain boast.

Perhaps you should reconsider John 12 despite your claim that you fully understand John's Gospel record.

???

This does not teach that Jesus is going to take us to heaven.

Kind regards
Trevor

Explain 2 Corinthians 5:1-10!! This will DESTROYED your whole plucking verses false teaching. Also 2 Timothy 4:1-8.

Explain me Revelation 20:11-15. Does this happened before the sea is no more or after?

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again Pipripi,

And what you called spiritual house is not our bodies. And also it is not in this world. The spiritual house is in heaven where God lives.

1 Corinthians 6:19 (KJV): What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
Ephesians 2:19-22 (KJV) 19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Explain 2 Corinthians 5:1-10!! This will DESTROYED your whole plucking verses false teaching. Also 2 Timothy 4:1-8.

These speak of the change from mortality to immortality that the faithful will receive when Jesus returns to establish the Kingdom of God upon the earth. Jesus brings this gift of immortality from heaven and changes our bodies and clothes us with immortality.

Explain me Revelation 20:11-15. Does this happened before the sea is no more or after?

There will be sea and rivers and islands during the 1000 year reign of Jesus upon the earth and there will be mortal nations with ships that bring gifts to Israel and Jerusalem and to Jesus during the 1000 years.
Psalm 72:8-11 (KJV): 8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth. 9 They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust. 10 The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts. 11 Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him.
You need to stop plucking verses with symbolic language from the book of Revelation and stop overriding the specific detail and teaching of the prophets concerning the Kingdom of God upon the earth for the 1000 years.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Pipiripi]

Greetings again Pipripi,

1 Corinthians 6:19 (KJV): What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
Ephesians 2:19-22 (KJV) 19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

These speak of the change from mortality to immortality that the faithful will receive when Jesus returns to establish the Kingdom of God upon the earth. Jesus brings this gift of immortality from heaven and changes our bodies and clothes us with immortality.

No Trevor, the change from mortality to immortality will happened now when Jesus returns. It is impossible to stand before Jesus and all His angels coming down with great power and fire. Even the sea will dry out. So you and all that doesn't will be prepared don't have the time to see all this.

There will be sea and rivers and islands during the 1000 year reign of Jesus upon the earth and there will be mortal nations with ships that bring gifts to Israel and Jerusalem and to Jesus during the 1000 years.

So then when shall the sea are no more? At what events? Show me it only from the Bible!!

Psalm 72:8-11 (KJV): 8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth. 9 They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust. 10 The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts. 11 Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him.
You need to stop plucking verses with symbolic language from the book of Revelation and stop overriding the specific detail and teaching of the prophets concerning the Kingdom of God upon the earth for the 1000 years.

Did you know who have write this Psalm? Do you have read verse 1:20? Should I have to pay a ticket 🎟 to come show you how to read a Bible, then studied it?

In my Bible it said: dedicated to Solomon!! Do you also have it written so? Do you understand who dedicated this poem to who?

Again plucking verses here and there and building a fantasy illusion!!

By the way! Trevor my brother in Christ, when do you finished in your plucking book to put the famous "no sea" between your literally Israel on earth and Jesus fighting against Satan? Because you have just tell me that when Jesus is ruling the earth there will be sea. Help me!!

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again Pipripi,

No Trevor, the change from mortality to immortality will happened now when Jesus returns. It is impossible to stand before Jesus and all His angels coming down with great power and fire. Even the sea will dry out. So you and all that doesn't will be prepared don't have the time to see all this.

You are trying to impose the SDA theology of the earth being burnt and then desolate for the 1000 years. Acts 3:19,20,21 speak about what will happen when Jesus returns, he will bring times of restoration and refreshing. Please note that Peter states that this anticipated in what is stated in ALL the prophets verse 21:
Acts 3:19–21 (KJV): 19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; 20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: 21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

So then when shall the sea are no more? At what events? Show me it only from the Bible!!

Again you are plucking a symbolic or figurative item from the Book of Revelation, claiming it is literal and ignoring the clear, simple teaching of the prophets as also stated in Acts 3:19-21.

Did you know who have write this Psalm? Do you have read verse 1:20? Should I have to pay a ticket 🎟 to come show you how to read a Bible, then studied it?
In my Bible it said: dedicated to Solomon!! Do you also have it written so? Do you understand who dedicated this poem to who?
Again plucking verses here and there and building a fantasy illusion!!

In an earlier post you claimed that you fully understood the Gospel record of John. Do you claim the same for the Psalms? One feature of the Psalms, and for that matter much of the prophets and their prophecies, they have an application in the time of the prophets, and yet they are a framework for future things, more applicable to the sufferings of Christ and the Glorification of Jesus and His future Kingdom. Here in Psalm 72 are some of the verses that were partially or typically fulfilled with Solomon, but have their main fulfillment in Christ:
Psalm 72:1–20 (KJV): 1 Give the king thy judgments, O God, and thy righteousness unto the king’s son. 2 He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment. 3 The mountains shall bring peace to the people, and the little hills, by righteousness. 4 He shall judge the poor of the people, he shall save the children of the needy, and shall break in pieces the oppressor. 5 They shall fear thee as long as the sun and moon endure, throughout all generations. 6 He shall come down like rain upon the mown grass: as showers that water the earth. 7 In his days shall the righteous flourish; and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth. 8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth. 9 They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust. 10 The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts. 11 Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him. 12 For he shall deliver the needy when he crieth; the poor also, and him that hath no helper. 13 He shall spare the poor and needy, and shall save the souls of the needy. 14 He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight. 15 And he shall live, and to him shall be given of the gold of Sheba: prayer also shall be made for him continually; and daily shall he be praised. 16 There shall be an handful of corn in the earth upon the top of the mountains; the fruit thereof shall shake like Lebanon: and they of the city shall flourish like grass of the earth. 17 His name shall endure for ever: his name shall be continued as long as the sun: and men shall be blessed in him: all nations shall call him blessed. 18 Blessed be the LORD God, the God of Israel, who only doeth wondrous things. 19 And blessed be his glorious name for ever: and let the whole earth be filled with his glory; Amen, and Amen. 20 The prayers of David the son of Jesse are ended.

Please note that Psalm 72 is written and spoken towards the end of David's life as mentioned in Psalm 72:20. Please also consider the following described as the Last Words of David:
2 Samuel 23:1–5 (KJV): 1 Now these be the last words of David. David the son of Jesse said, and the man who was raised up on high, the anointed of the God of Jacob, and the sweet psalmist of Israel, said, 2 The Spirit of the LORD spake by me, and his word was in my tongue. 3 The God of Israel said, the Rock of Israel spake to me, He that ruleth over men must be just, ruling in the fear of God. 4 And he shall be as the light of the morning, when the sun riseth, even a morning without clouds; as the tender grass springing out of the earth by clear shining after rain. 5 Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.
David has no allusion that all the detail of Psalm 72 would be fulfilled by Solomon. Here, in his last words, David looks forward to the reign of Jesus upon the earth for the 1000 years. Also like Psalm 72:6 that speaks of the Times of Refreshing (not a burnt earth) mentioned in Acts 3:19, and here 2 Samuel 23:4 speaks of ""the tender grass springing out the earth by clear shining after rain.

By the way! Trevor my brother in Christ, when do you finished in your plucking book to put the famous "no sea" between your literally Israel on earth and Jesus fighting against Satan? Because you have just tell me that when Jesus is ruling the earth there will be sea. Help me!!

I hope that one day you will understand what is represented in the Book of Revelation by the phrase "no more sea" Revelation 21:1. I will reserve my understanding of this. It will be interesting to see how often you pluck this phrase from the Book of Revelation in order to overwrite the teachings of the prophets.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[shroom]

I hope that one day you will understand what is represented in the Book of Revelation by the phrase "no more sea" Revelation 21:1. I will reserve my understanding of this.

I have ideas on that one, too. I'm interested to hear yours.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings shroom,

I have ideas on that one, too. I'm interested to hear yours.

Possibly the difference between my position and the SDAs is that they mainly learn the concept of New Jerusalem coming down from heaven and here, "no more sea". My own experience with the Book of Revelation is that I studied the first three chapters in my youth, and found the following chapters difficult at the time, especially what I consider covers the historical period from AD 96 to the return of Jesus. Over the years I gradually came to understand some portions, while other portions were still in the too hard basket. It has only been in the last few years that our Senior Sunday School Class has been gradually and thoroughly working through the whole book of Revelation. We have now reached Revelation Chapter 16. I have now formed strong opinions on Revelation Chapters 1-15. This is my present progress, now nearly 60 years later. I will reserve my tentative view of Revelation Chapters 20-22 until we reach this in our studies, but consider the SDA gloss of these chapters obviously erroneous as they are only interested in negating what the prophets teach. Feel free to express your view of "no more sea".

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Pipiripi]

Greetings again Pipripi,

You are trying to impose the SDA theology of the earth being burnt and then desolate for the 1000 years.

I am not trying, and this teaching is not of the SDA Church. It is written in the Bible. And don't forget that the SDAs church of the pioneers, has a nickname: "Church of the Bible". Matthew 13:40; Go read 2 Peter 3:6-13. Is this also a parable!! When shall Jesus Christ returns? Before your Jerusalem on earth or after? Because the Bible is clear with the SECOND COMING OF CHRIST!!

Acts 3:19,20,21 speak about what will happen when Jesus returns, he will bring times of restoration and refreshing. Please note that Peter states that this anticipated in what is stated in ALL the prophets verse 21:

Go read again 2 Peter 3:6-13!! Are Peter an apostle of Christ?

Acts 3:19–21 (KJV): 19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; 20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: 21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Again you are plucking a symbolic or figurative item from the Book of Revelation, claiming it is literal and ignoring the clear, simple teaching of the prophets as also stated in Acts 3:19-21.

Read what Peter said!! Should I must looking for more? Or you are trying to go pluck for moreevidence?

In an earlier post you claimed that you fully understood the Gospel record of John. Do you claim the same for the Psalms? One feature of the Psalms, and for that matter much of the prophets and their prophecies, they have an application in the time of the prophets, and yet they are a framework for future things, more applicable to the sufferings of Christ and the Glorification of Jesus and His future Kingdom. Here in Psalm 72 are some of the verses that were partially or typically fulfilled with Solomon, but have their main fulfillment in Christ:

I'm agree with you. But Solomon and David, this people have their prophets in their time that are consulting God for them. And all the prophets get vision about the future. It doesn't matter what time God gives them to see in the future. Daniel saw the end of this world. But God told him to not write it down. Because it is far in the future. And then John received this end times Revelation till the return of Jesus at the third time.

Psalm 72:1–20 (KJV): 1 Give the king thy judgments, O God, and thy righteousness unto the king’s son. 2 He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment. 3 The mountains shall bring peace to the people, and the little hills, by righteousness. 4 He shall judge the poor of the people, he shall save the children of the needy, and shall break in pieces the oppressor. 5 They shall fear thee as long as the sun and moon endure, throughout all generations. 6 He shall come down like rain upon the mown grass: as showers that water the earth. 7 In his days shall the righteous flourish; and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth. 8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth. 9 They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust. 10 The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts. 11 Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him. 12 For he shall deliver the needy when he crieth; the poor also, and him that hath no helper. 13 He shall spare the poor and needy, and shall save the souls of the needy. 14 He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight. 15 And he shall live, and to him shall be given of the gold of Sheba: prayer also shall be made for him continually; and daily shall he be praised. 16 There shall be an handful of corn in the earth upon the top of the mountains; the fruit thereof shall shake like Lebanon: and they of the city shall flourish like grass of the earth. 17 His name shall endure for ever: his name shall be continued as long as the sun: and men shall be blessed in him: all nations shall call him blessed. 18 Blessed be the LORD God, the God of Israel, who only doeth wondrous things. 19 And blessed be his glorious name for ever: and let the whole earth be filled with his glory; Amen, and Amen. 20 The prayers of David the son of Jesse are ended.

Please note that Psalm 72 is written and spoken towards the end of David's life as mentioned in Psalm 72:20. Please also consider the following described as the Last Words of David.

But earlier you have put it in another way. Go read it again. Because of my questions you have wake up a little that this Psalm has nothing to do about what you have write before.

2 Samuel 23:1–5 (KJV): 1 Now these be the last words of David. David the son of Jesse said, and the man who was raised up on high, the anointed of the God of Jacob, and the sweet psalmist of Israel, said, 2 The Spirit of the LORD spake by me, and his word was in my tongue. 3 The God of Israel said, the Rock of Israel spake to me, He that ruleth over men must be just, ruling in the fear of God. 4 And he shall be as the light of the morning, when the sun riseth, even a morning without clouds; as the tender grass springing out of the earth by clear shining after rain. 5 Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.
David has no allusion that all the detail of Psalm 72 would be fulfilled by Solomon. Here, in his last words, David looks forward to the reign of Jesus upon the earth for the 1000 years. Also like Psalm 72:6 that speaks of the Times of Refreshing (not a burnt earth) mentioned in Acts 3:19, and here 2 Samuel 23:4 speaks of ""the tender grass springing out the earth by clear shining after rain.

No not true. Jesus Himself says that His kingdom is NOT of this earth. This earth kingdom is from Satan. He is the ruler of yours earth. Go read John 17 again exactly how I have copy it, without pasting. And also tells you all, that Pipiripi also is NOT FROM THIS EARTH. ThThat's why He will return to bring me to His kingdom in heaven into His Father house, living in a mansion for 1000 millennial reign in heaven. And this burning earth will have his 1000 years Sabbath rest, just as we have learned in the Old Testament, 6 years is working in the barnyard, and the 7 year is no working. Everybody must eat what the yard gives. Today this is about 6000 years old. God has delayed the coming of Jesus, because He is waiting for you to stop plucking verses, and start reading my manual of life that shroom has given to you all.

I hope that one day you will understand what is represented in the Book of Revelation by the phrase "no more sea" Revelation 21:1. I will reserve my understanding of this. It will be interesting to see how often you pluck this phrase from the Book of Revelation in order to overwrite the teachings of the prophets.

Go read 2 Peter 3:6-13 again!! This time maybe you can wake up. Take a look who also melt away!!

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again Pipripi,

I am not trying, and this teaching is not of the SDA Church. It is written in the Bible. And don't forget that the SDAs church of the pioneers, has a nickname: "Church of the Bible". Matthew 13:40; Go read 2 Peter 3:6-13. Is this also a parable!!

Go read again 2 Peter 3:6-13!! Are Peter an apostle of Christ?

I understand 2 Peter 3:6-13 is speaking about the fiery judgements when Christ returns. It is figurative language and is not speaking about a complete destruction of all the people upon the earth.

When shall Jesus Christ returns? Before your Jerusalem on earth or after? Because the Bible is clear with the SECOND COMING OF CHRIST!!

I understand the sequence is that Christ returns, raises the responsible dead, gathers the responsible and then judges them and grants immortality to the faithful. Some time after is the Battle of Armageddon, and Jesus intervenes and destroys these armies. Israel is then converted and the nations are invited to accept the Rule of Jesus as King, and invited to come out of Babylon. The building of the Temple will commence possibly soon after the conversion of Israel, and before all the nations are subjected.

But earlier you have put it in another way. Go read it again. Because of my questions you have wake up a little that this Psalm has nothing to do about what you have write before.

Not sure what you are claiming here. I hold strongly that Psalm 72 is mainly speaking about Jesus and the Kingdom of God upon the earth for the 1000 years. You may refer to my Thread "Psalm 72 - The Kingdom of God Soon to be Established on Earth". You responded to this as Post #2, and I replied in Post #3.

No not true. Jesus Himself says that His kingdom is NOT of this earth.

Jesus is saying his power and authority was not from this earth, nor from the Jewish world of that time. His Kingdom is from heaven, not in heaven.

Kind regards
Trevor