"Thin-terpretations"--passages poorly supported in popular usage

[Arial]

When you see that still water in a desert margin area are often toxic, then going past them makes perfect sense.

I'm sure a good shepherd would be on the lookout for such and take appropriate measures. I am also sure that a good shepherd would provide the type of water to drink that the flock is comfortable with.

 

[Arial]

You can't be serious. Zero? It is beautiful in this other rendering because it deals with the hardness of the world in spots, just like "in the presence of my enemies" is about hard reality, too.

The entire Psalm in its analogy deals with everything we might encounter. It is about our Shepherd being there in the midst of it all, defending, protecting, providing. It is about trusting Him in all things and situations because He is the Good Shepherd, and the assurance of His love for His people "goodness and mercy following them" (I often think of them as the sheepdogs) and the assurance that even in the presence of our enemies (literal and figurative) or walking through the valley of the shadow of death (which this part of our life on earth is, and sometimes with great suffering and turmoil)we will always and forever dwell with Him in His house.

For 10 years, Luther thought the righteousness of God in Romans was his exacting and terrible wrath. Only by immersion in language did he realize it was not that at all, but was actually the most important act or work of God for him! It was God loving us and giving himself up for us!

Well it is God's holy righteousness that justly exacts wrath on His enemies. That is one side of it. It is Christ's righteousness imputed through faith to the believer, that saves them from this wrath. That is the other side. Was Luther's understanding altered through immersion in language? I don't know. It may have been, and it may have been helpful to him. That does not mean we are all void of knowledge and understanding unless we immerse ourselves in language. If that were the case, it would become a requirement for salvation and the source of faith.

 

[APAK]

It is simply telling us how God cares for His covenant people, and is not restricted to only Israel (Jesus the Good Shepherd) but also is applicable to all those joined to Christ through faith. We are in the hands of the Good Shepherd, who provides, protects, guides, watches over, us, His flock. We need not fear even though we walk through the valley of the shadow of death for He is with us---as the Psalm begins the transitions to us, having set the metaphor of the relationship---sheep to Shepherd, Shepherd to sheep. The rod and the staff in the use of the shepherd are to defend against wild beasts, to direct and keep track of the sheep, the staff to rescue them from danger. Careful note should be made in the heart and mind of the reader, of the relationship (and a relationship it is.) He is in charge. He is the one with the wisdom and power and love and concern for the flock. We, the flock, can be at peace trusting in Him. "Do not worry or fret---" He says. Follow Him.

Got it Arial and thanks for the protracted explanation....

 

[EarlyActs]

The entire Psalm in its analogy deals with everything we might encounter. It is about our Shepherd being there in the midst of it all, defending, protecting, providing. It is about trusting Him in all things and situations because He is the Good Shepherd, and the assurance of His love for His people "goodness and mercy following them" (I often think of them as the sheepdogs) and the assurance that even in the presence of our enemies (literal and figurative) or walking through the valley of the shadow of death (which this part of our life on earth is, and sometimes with great suffering and turmoil)we will always and forever dwell with Him in His house.

Well it is God's holy righteousness that justly exacts wrath on His enemies. That is one side of it. It is Christ's righteousness imputed through faith to the believer, that saves them from this wrath. That is the other side. Was Luther's understanding altered through immersion in language? I don't know. It may have been, and it may have been helpful to him. That does not mean we are all void of knowledge and understanding unless we immerse ourselves in language. If that were the case, it would become a requirement for salvation and the source of faith.

 

[EarlyActs]

The entire Psalm in its analogy deals with everything we might encounter. It is about our Shepherd being there in the midst of it all, defending, protecting, providing. It is about trusting Him in all things and situations because He is the Good Shepherd, and the assurance of His love for His people "goodness and mercy following them" (I often think of them as the sheepdogs) and the assurance that even in the presence of our enemies (literal and figurative) or walking through the valley of the shadow of death (which this part of our life on earth is, and sometimes with great suffering and turmoil)we will always and forever dwell with Him in His house.

Well it is God's holy righteousness that justly exacts wrath on His enemies. That is one side of it. It is Christ's righteousness imputed through faith to the believer, that saves them from this wrath. That is the other side. Was Luther's understanding altered through immersion in language? I don't know. It may have been, and it may have been helpful to him. That does not mean we are all void of knowledge and understanding unless we immerse ourselves in language. If that were the case, it would become a requirement for salvation and the source of faith.

I'm confused. If God protects us as the psalm says, what difference does the detail make? He maybe does it more ways than you thought, so what?

As for language immersion, yes, God used the language immersion to help him see that something else was meant. There is no connection at all to "requirement for salvation".

I don't know how the bee got in your bonnet but it sure is. I'm here to add to your background, not cause you to lose any. Maybe switch to another one of the examples.

 

[EarlyActs]

You jumped on a scholarly bandwagon when you used the water of Psalm 23 as one of your thin-translations. Thinking, I guess, that all that anyone else had ever thought about the Psalm or taken from it, was wrong. In so doing, you slanted the Psalm one direction that it was not going (yet) and removed some of what it was saying at that particular time (with those poetic and analogous phrases).That these scholars and translator supperceded all the intellect of ancient times and that if we were going to be absolutely, technically correct (which analogies and poetry are not meant to be, but rather to convey a concept or idea) we are to now see not peace and loving perfect provision that takes each individual into account, in the still waters, but rather dangers that we are kept from. Even though that aspect of God's care is put forth with the same sheep/shepherd analogy in the next verses. We need know neither the nature of sheep or the conditions of the Bedouin desert to extract the meaning and purpose of Psalm 23. There was no place for it in your examples of thin-translations.

More than anything else it was put forth from an exalting of superior human intellect and an appearance of having it.

I did not change the direction of the psalm at all. I found a more exact example from recent research, so stop talking to me and go blast the researchers. What a waste.

 

[EarlyActs]

I'm sure a good shepherd would be on the lookout for such and take appropriat

measures. I am also sure that a good shepherd would provide the type of water to drink that the flock is comfortable with.

Where do we disagree?

 

[Arial]

Where do we disagree?

You seemed to be denying the validity of beside still waters meaning beside still waters. But we have talked about it enough.

 

[Arial]

I'm confused. If God protects us as the psalm says, what difference does the detail make?

That is what I have been saying all along!!And you keep contradicting me saying the details do matter.
@EarlyActs
For someone who is always magnifying his intelligence and study and degrees and what not, it sure takes a long time for you to get a light bulb screwed in. And then----you act like it was your brilliance!

 

[Arial]

I don't know how the bee got in your bonnet but it sure is.

The bee was in your bonnet bub and if you go back and read every post you posted to everyone who brought up their version of beside still waters, you will see that.

 

[EarlyActs]

If God protects from something toxic, what is your objection? And that is what the line is about.

You do realize you have operated on the level of translation, which is 2nd or 3rd hand, right? To be on the level of the original material, you have to find journal articles by those who do so (unless you had opportunity for language immersion) or you find them condensed in literary lexicons. It is standard scholarship.

If you are not familiar with how wide range some of these ancient prepositions are (the Heb. for past), look up para sometime in Greek construction, especially as it can become attached to some verbs, too! It makes for 3 different directions very easily: against, supportive and further beyond the verb or object it is modifying.

There are 6 other topics to talk about.

I don't know what a bub is but maybe you are around them a lot? My name is Marcus Sanford, my site is Interplans.net. I was invited to speak to the Am Assoc of Pop Culture on the 'term nature and how it changed in the 20th century.' I have a documentary on an incident in connection with the French Revolution that has a couple awards. My thesis in my master's program was on Luke-Acts and the Jewish War. I currently help run a weekly high school seminar group needed for a Christian home school, a weekly science and culture Christian video viewing group, and a Christian high school speech/debate group.

If you have some actual language background that has been overlooked, forgive me, but I didn't notice, and I don't know what a bub is.

 

[Arial]

and I don't know what a bub is.

Maybe you should have immersed yourself in the language and looked it up. And when you do, keep in mind that, as with many other words, it can be used sarcastically and often is. Context and common sense will note the usage.

My name is Marcus Sanford, my site is Interplans.net. I was invited to speak to the Am Assoc of Pop Culture on the 'term nature and how it changed in the 20th century.' I have a documentary on an incident in connection with the French Revolution that has a couple awards. My thesis in my master's program was on Luke-Acts and the Jewish War. I currently help run a weekly high school seminar group needed for a Christian home school, a weekly science and culture Christian video viewing group, and a Christian high school speech/debate group.

Therefore, you all, that makes this person the authority on all he says. Except when he is putting forth the authority of someone he has put himself under the authority of. Don't dare question him, or have a different view, or you will have to hear some more of this self adulation and condescension towards others . Personally I prefer to simply read a scripture, trust God, and learn what He has to say about Himself and my relationship to Him, and find answers to questions within the scriptures. Not discounting helps from true and trustworthy theologians, and checking all of them within the scripture itself. (But not those who focus on persnickety details of various translations, like should beside be translated past or alongside of, was this water good water or toxic water, instead of God and the message He is giving.)But make no mistake, I advise not doing this openly unless one is willing to take being made known as a simpleton, and to have this pointed out by someone who considers their credentials as the surest way of attaining eternal life.

Personally I find it amusing. So let's go back to his other, six was it, thin-terpretations, and see it they are all just more of the same excuse to point out the stupidity of lesser humans, or do they actually have some edifying and/or enlightening purpose? But first I will have another cup of coffee, brush my teeth, wash my face (and a beautiful morning it is) play ball with my dog and maybe pop out to the grocery store.