• Welcome to White Horse Forums. We ask that you would please take a moment to introduce yourself in the New Members section. Tell us a bit about yourself and dive in!

Jesus' God

meshak said:
Come to think of it, I don't think you know what Jesus is saying.

And in my estimation, most trins don't know the simple saying of Jesus' word.

that's why they can believe Jesus God is a triune god.

Tell me what do you think He is saying?

@Arial
Click to expand...
I asked you first.
You want me to tell you what I think it means so you will be able to answer that I don't know what He is saying and don't believe what He is saying, and don't follow Him, and am one of those TRINS. But you still won't tell me what it means. I don't think you know. And I'm not going to tell you.
 
meshak said:
Is this an honest question or a trick question?
Click to expand...
It is an honest question. Are you going to answer it now? I know what it means. I am asking what you say it means to see if they are the same.
 
Arial said:
It is an honest question. Are you going to answer it now? I know what it means. I am asking what you say it means to see if they are the same.
Click to expand...
that means to keep His commandments.

Jesus is the Lord and the Teacher.

that says it all.
 
meshak said:
that means to keep His commandments.

Jesus is the Lord and the Teacher.

that says it all.
Click to expand...
"I am the door of the sheep. All who ever came before Me are thieves and robber but the sheep did not hear them. I am the door (gate in some translations). If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture." Jesus is talking to the Jews who thought the way was keeping the commandments. We are to keep His commandments but keeping the commandments is not the way. Jesus Himself is the way. That means we have to be joined to Him somehow spiritually so that we enter by Him.It is faith in Him to do whatever is necessary to save us that joins us to Him. And He did all that was necessary. He kept all the commandments perfectly, then died as though He were the sinner and not us. He took our place. He rose again to life and returned to the Father and there He intercedes for us. He sent the Holy Spirit to teach us how to please God with obedience. And He promises in these scriptures, that when we have that faith in Him, we are saved.
 
Arial said:
"I am the door of the sheep. All who ever came before Me are thieves and robber but the sheep did not hear them. I am the door (gate in some translations). If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture." Jesus is talking to the Jews who thought the way was keeping the commandments. We are to keep His commandments but keeping the commandments is not the way. Jesus Himself is the way. That means we have to be joined to Him somehow spiritually so that we enter by Him.It is faith in Him to do whatever is necessary to save us that joins us to Him. And He did all that was necessary. He kept all the commandments perfectly, then died as though He were the sinner and not us. He took our place. He rose again to life and returned to the Father and there He intercedes for us. He sent the Holy Spirit to teach us how to please God with obedience. And He promises in these scriptures, that when we have that faith in Him, we are saved.
Click to expand...
So you disagree with my assessment?
 
APAK said:
(Eph 4:20) But that is not the way you learned Christ!—
(Eph 4:21) assuming that you have heard about him and were taught in him, as the truth is in Jesus,
(Eph 4:22) to put off your old self, which belongs to your former manner of life and is corrupt through deceitful desires,
(Eph 4:23) and to be renewed in the spirit of your minds,
(Eph 4:24) and to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.(ESV)

As I already said we' kill off' or 'put off' the old man as Paul says in Ephesians 4:20-24.
Click to expand...
Kill off and put off are two different things. You can't renew yourself to be renewed is to not resist the Spirit's work.
APAK said:
And you quoted Eph 2:5 that does not address the subject at all. Christ made it possible for us to kill the old man and become saved, and being saved today, although we must do it, not he. We must be renewed in spirit of mind. Rid ourselves of the selfish, sinful way we naturally think and act in this evil world. Christ cannot do this for us. Again this was appropriate for the subject of salvation I was always speaking on here.
Click to expand...
No, we put off the old man. It is already dead. It died when we came into Christ. That is how we crucify the flesh and its desires. So the question is, how do we come into Christ.
APAK said:
And further, you have misread Acts 14:22 not I. It says what I wrote.
(Act 14:22) strengthening the souls of the disciples, encouraging them to continue in the faith, and saying that through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God. (ESV)
Click to expand...
The trials and tabulations will come. They come to all people on this mortal coil period. The message here is that we are not going to receive special treatment on this temporal plane until by becoming Christians. The trials have nothing to do with entering the Kingdom other than the ancillary affect of strengthening the faith of a true believer. It has the opposite effect on the nominal Christian.

APAK said:
It is all about faith and perseverance and endurance to overcome trials of faith in life and always point to the Kingdom not fully realized yet.
And then you point to sinners in tribulation as much as saints, remarkable! As if they are able to be in the Kingdom, what an incredible thought.
It has nothing to do with sinners, it is aimed at reborn believers in the Kingdom today. Do you not understand the difference between being a believer in tribulation and a non-believer in the same? You are writing as if I meant they were the same thing, impossible.
Click to expand...
I am saying that attributing our salvation and sonship to God to trails and tribulations is a faulty concept.
APAK said:
And finally for your last blunted dart of 3 John 1:2 you presented....:cool:;)
(3Jn 1:1) The elder to the beloved Gaius, whom I love in truth.
(3Jn 1:2) Beloved, I pray that all may go well with you and that you may be in good health, as it goes well with your soul.
(3Jn 1:3) For I rejoiced greatly when the brothers came and testified to your truth, as indeed you are walking in the truth.
(3Jn 1:4) I have no greater joy than to hear that my children are walking in the truth. (ESV)

This is part of a greeting to a believer in Christ. John yes, wants this Gaius to have mental and physical health as this will help keep his spiritual life, his overall soul well also. It will support it no doubt. Again this is for the exterior life of a believer. I'm not speaking of this exterior feature in life. Again my subject is of salvation of the inner life and walk in Christ. The verse here you raised is mutually exclusive with the subject at hand. I hope you understand this critical point.
Click to expand...
I hope you understand the critical point that the New Testament is speaking about physical tribulation.
APAK said:
Now for another scripture.

(Rom 5:3) " More than that, we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, "
(Rom 5:4) " and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, "
(Rom 5:5) " and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit which has been given to us. "
Click to expand...
This is the natural way. All people suffer. God uses it for goo for his kids. How have you suffered for Christ?
APAK said:
The words of this scripture I live every day in some fashion and degree. My spirit that is being transformed as Christ is operating in a hostile environment today. My flesh is cursed as an enemy, and the spirit of this world is the same. How can a true believer be not in some type of defensive posture and under pressure at times to ward of these attacks when they arrive, with the full armor of God?
Click to expand...
I am rejoicing in Christ. I simply look to Christ with a steadfast gaze because He has saved me and I love Him. Therefore I have nothing to fear as I abide in Him. Rejoice and again I say rejoice!
APAK said:
Yes, I have physical health and good mental faculties, and I pray for them to stay this way as I grow older, as John wished upon this man. I also pray to and for my inner spiritual life with God through the spirit of Christ to know him more and prosper in knowledge and wisdom. To praise God for the truth I have of him inside of me.

Again when you said, "Suffering is not the way to salvation, Jesus is and Jesus turns our suffering into victory," you are ignorant of what type of suffering that Jesus cannot turn it into victory by himself. Why, because this span of time of this 'suffering' in opening up our hearts for salvation has to be done with the love of God on our side as we become a new rebirth of God. We accept the faith given to us by the gift and grace of God, as we in trust for the FIRST time, walk across this bridging faith to meet him on the other side as we have already opened the door to our heart and to be with and in him. This is the victory through this type of suffering or pressure.
Click to expand...
What have you suffered for him? I am not talking about the natural suffering all men experience. What have you suffered directly for Christ?
APAK said:
Maybe the word suffering is putting you off. Too much then, so stick to other words like pressure, sweat, struggle, straining, in finding the strength and the motivation to keep on the right path to the right gate. It's an unnatural act of man to depend on God for a free gift of faith to salvation. It is an alien thing.

And if you meant in your statement above this suffering is only applicable after you are saved in Christ then I would agree of course. These sufferings can be turned into victories indeed. amen!

And then you do acknowledge that a believer does suffer in spirit, as we are working through or working it out as being saved today and tomorrow?! You must, I hope.
Click to expand...
Your experience is very negative and dark. I do not experience Christ that way. Are you trying to earn your salvation?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top