Is The Bible A Failure?

[Studyman]

Dude, you really need to chill. You have put a lot of work into making a post that does not reflect very much of what I believe and the few things you got partially right are still lacking in context.


I suppose it is partially my fault I need to simplify things for you when I post. I could answer your post and show you all of the mistakes you made but then we would have a book. Perhaps I’ll take some time later to point out a few things that you got wrong.

The problem with that is that you rarely listen to what other people say and are mostly interested in what you have to say.

That's probably it GA. You are just so Holy and beyond reproach, that I am simply to stupid to comprehend your superior intellect. How dare I, one of the great unwashed, question your religious philosophy, right? I would really appreciate it though, if you could come down off the mountain, and explain things to me in a manner more closely associated with my ignorance and lack of learning at the feet of the Great Religious Philosophers of our time. I don't need a book, I already have one I trust. Why don't you just bless me with the answer to these two questions regarding your posts.

Namely;

#1. How does a man cast out devils in Jesus Name, if Jesus doesn't even know him?

#2. Where is your Scriptural support for your preaching that in Jesus Time, there were "MANY" running around Jerusalem calling Him Lord, Lord, and Prophesying in His Name?

I would add that I respond to your posts, because I "DO" Listen to you, not because I don't.

Thank you.

 

[Mr E]

You're a Bible denier too? ...makes sense, I suppose. You think Jesus Christ sinned, when the Bible says many times that he did not.

All men are sinners shroom.

Hi Mr E,
It is an interesting dilemma.
When we think of divinely inspired word and Pauline texts... the idea that he surrenders in writing to the influence of the Holy Spirit can raise a complex...
Do we consider surrender as Paul having non-agency? He would have personal agency. Wonder if the term cooperation with the Holy Spirit could be a useful way of seeing it.
Well, interesting consideration,
Blessings Mr E
LB

Not much of a conundrum. I can read why Paul wrote— he says “I, not the Lord” which leaves us wondering how often Paul speaks for himself.

 

[Mr E]

You're a Bible denier too? ...makes sense, I suppose. You think Jesus Christ sinned, when the Bible says many times that he did not.

All have sinned shroom. You recognize that Jesus was a man, but stumble here by inserting an exception for that particular man, that scripture doesn’t allow for.

 

[shroom]

All have sinned shroom.

Not Jesus Christ.

You recognize that Jesus was a man,

Yes.

but stumble here by inserting an exception for that particular man, that scripture doesn’t allow for.

The Bible inserts the exception. It explicitly states in several places that Jesus Christ did not sin. You deny what the Bible explicitly states.

 

[Mr E]

Not Jesus Christ.


Yes.


The Bible inserts the exception. It explicitly states in several places that Jesus Christ did not sin. You deny what the Bible explicitly states.

You simply don’t recognize what sin is. It’s the condition of all men, not simply the behavior. The verses you point to as stipulating sinlessness don’t refer to the man Jesus, but the spirit (the son of God) within him, that he called Lord.

The Holy Spirit of God is sinless. And no man.

 

[shroom]

You simply don’t recognize what sin is. It’s the condition of all men, not simply the behavior.

It's not the condition of Jesus Christ. There is a reason God was his Father. He did not inherit the sinful condition (sin nature) all the rest of us inherited from Adam. Jesus Christ was just like Adam was before Adam sinned. Adam sinned, condemning himself and all his progeny to death. Jesus Christ did not sin, then gave his life as the only acceptable sacrifice for the sinful condition and sins of man.

The verses you point to as stipulating sinlessness don’t refer to the man Jesus, but the spirit (the son of God) within him, that he called Lord.

They refer to the man Jesus. Jesus, the man, is the Son of God.

 

[Grace Accepted]

That's probably it GA. You are just so Holy and beyond reproach, that I am simply to stupid to comprehend your superior intellect. How dare I, one of the great unwashed, question your religious philosophy, right? I would really appreciate it though, if you could come down off the mountain, and explain things to me in a manner more closely associated with my ignorance and lack of learning at the feet of the Great Religious Philosophers of our time. I don't need a book, I already have one I trust. Why don't you just bless me with the answer to these two questions regarding your posts.

Namely;

#1. How does a man cast out devils in Jesus Name, if Jesus doesn't even know him?

#2. Where is your Scriptural support for your preaching that in Jesus Time, there were "MANY" running around Jerusalem calling Him Lord, Lord, and Prophesying in His Name?

I would add that I respond to your posts, because I "DO" Listen to you, not because I don't.

Thank you.

You are not listening. There is nothing in the narrative that indicates Jesus admonished them for casting out demons. I will try to state this in very simple terms.

1. No man will be with God in heaven who loves darkness and loves sin.
2. No man who loves God loves sin.
3. We are set free from sin by the blood of Jesus Christ and made perfect forever whilst being made holy.
4. No man can stop sinning apart from God's power.
5. We identify foolish men by their ignoring of God.
6. We identify wise men by their adhering to God

No evil man can do good because goodness comes from a good heart.

No man can change his heart. Salvation is for the sinner. It is to save them from sin by not counting their sins against them and removing their heart of stone and replacing it with a heart of flesh. As God does this good work in us, our hearts he will change and so our behavior will change because goodness is in our hearts but we didn't put it there, he did.

The idea that God demands obedience and will reward us for it or kill us for not doing so, is not who God is. God will save everyone who does not resist him and He will put a new heart in the filled with His righteousness. Right behavior will follow.

We are not damned because of bad behavior and we are not saved due to good behavior but bad behavior issues forth from dark hearts and good behavior shines from good hearts. So the saints will progressively be made holier and holier by Him working in them while still being counted as perfect forever.

Sinners will get darker and darker with sinful behaviors like black bile coming forth from their dark hearts.

 

[Phedup]

Hi Mr E,
It is an interesting dilemma.
When we think of divinely inspired word and Pauline texts... the idea that he surrenders in writing to the influence of the Holy Spirit can raise a complex...
Do we consider surrender as Paul having non-agency? He would have personal agency. Wonder if the term cooperation with the Holy Spirit could be a useful way of seeing it.
Well, interesting consideration,
Blessings Mr E
LB

Yes, you have Paul directly telling us that what followed isnot from God.

You also have Jesus telling us that there are parts of scripture that are not from God.

Matthew 19: 8 He said to them, “It was because you were so hard-hearted that Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. 9 And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for unchastity, and marries another commits adultery.”[a]

But the part I get a kick out of....

10 His disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is better not to marry.”

Cracks me up everytime.

And it is then fair to presume that the rest of the "You have heard it said...." are that too.

 

[The_drake_]

It's not the condition of Jesus Christ. There is a reason God was his Father. He did not inherit the sinful condition (sin nature) all the rest of us inherited from Adam. Jesus Christ was just like Adam was before Adam sinned. Adam sinned, condemning himself and all his progeny to death. Jesus Christ did not sin, then gave his life as the only acceptable sacrifice for the sinful condition and sins of man.


They refer to the man Jesus. Jesus, the man, is the Son of God.

Or maybe instead of going on and on about this impossible to resolve debate, and creating arcane theological explanations, we accept that we don't know how exactly it worked.

People are healed perfectly fine by the doc without knowing exactly how the medicine works, in fact many practicing doctors can't really explain the mechanism of action in some of the medicines they use to a perfectly satisfactory degree.

 

[L.B.]

Yes, you have Paul directly telling us that what followed isnot from God.

You also have Jesus telling us that there are parts of scripture that are not from God.

Matthew 19: 8 He said to them, “It was because you were so hard-hearted that Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. 9 And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for unchastity, and marries another commits adultery.”[a]

But the part I get a kick out of....

10 His disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is better not to marry.”

Cracks me up everytime.

And it is then fair to presume that the rest of the "You have heard it said...." are that too.

There are certainly scenes that bring a smile to me too!
Keep hold of that ability to smile- it has been a tough debate and humour really helps sustain comradery...
Thanks Phedup and many blessings

 

[shroom]

Or maybe instead of going on and on about this impossible to resolve debate

It's not impossible to resolve.

The Bible explicitly states in several places that Jesus Christ did not sin.

Mr. E. insists that Jesus sinned.

Either Mr. E. is wrong or the Bible is wrong.

If that is impossible for some people to resolve, that's on them.

 

[L.B.]

Or maybe instead of going on and on about this impossible to resolve debate, and creating arcane theological explanations, we accept that we don't know how exactly it worked.

People are healed perfectly fine by the doc without knowing exactly how the medicine works, in fact many practicing doctors can't really explain the mechanism of action in some of the medicines they use to a perfectly satisfactory degree.

Interesting point. Sometimes just knowing it works is okay: yet we are curious beings, wanting to work it out!