N
NetChaplain
Guest
You can't desire evil and holiness! If God did not "work" this in us we would go our own way!
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S
shroom
Guest
Many Christians do go their own way. Paul "went his own way" when he was determined to go to Jerusalem even after being repeatedly warned by God not to go (Acts 20:22ff). It nearly cost him his life.You can't desire evil and holiness! If God did not "work" this in us we would go our own way!
God absolutely does work in Christians to will and to do His good pleasure, and we should be listening, and make every effort to do what God wants us to do. But He does not possess people, He does not force them to do what He wants. If He did, we would never sin again.
N
NetChaplain
Guest
Yes, He gives us a heart after Him! We are to endure the sin nature to learn of His holiness; which of course is well worth enduring His plan of salvation. Our sin nature is used to bring us as close as possible to God, which is enduring what we must through the sin nature--so we could be--not just with Him (as Adam and Eve), but in Him!Many Christians do go their own way. Paul "went his own way" when he was determined to go to Jerusalem even after being repeatedly warned by God not to go (Acts 20:22ff). It nearly cost him his life.
God absolutely does work in Christians to will and to do His good pleasure, and we should be listening, and make every effort to do what God wants us to do. But He does not possess people, He does not force them to do what He wants. If He did, we would never sin again.
T
TrevorL
Guest
Greetings again Grace Accepted,
Kind regards
Trevor
Your question(s) superimposes your thinking upon the character of God who needs to be revered, not used in this sort of question. The question also superimposes upon me that you believe that unless I am agreeing with your position, then I am almost guilty of such perverted thoughts or assessment of the character of God. I was going to quote both of your posts, but I would feel guilty if I repeated what you asked. Subject closed.Ok, in other words you are not going to answer. That’s ok, it is a tough question.
Kind regards
Trevor
M
Mr G Lee
Guest
When using the word superimposes do you mean another way of understanding . Like that of parables another level of understanding?Greetings again Grace Accepted,
Your question(s) superimposes your thinking upon the character of God who needs to be revered, not used in this sort of question. The question also superimposes upon me that you believe that unless I am agreeing with your position, then I am almost guilty of such perverted thoughts or assessment of the character of God. I was going to quote both of your posts, but I would feel guilty if I repeated what you asked. Subject closed.
Kind regards
Trevor
G
Grace Accepted
Guest
You need say no more, you are just not going to answer and I understand why. Giving a moral scolding on your superior understanding of God is not necessary.Greetings again Grace Accepted,
Your question(s) superimposes your thinking upon the character of God who needs to be revered, not used in this sort of question. The question also superimposes upon me that you believe that unless I am agreeing with your position, then I am almost guilty of such perverted thoughts or assessment of the character of God. I was going to quote both of your posts, but I would feel guilty if I repeated what you asked. Subject closed.
Kind regards
Trevor
T
TrevorL
Guest
Greetings again Grace Accepted,
Matthew 24:12: Under severe trial many will fall away.
1 Corinthians 9:26-27: The fight against sin is ongoing, with the possibility of rejection if we fail, if our love for the things of God becomes dull and ineffectual.
1 Timothy 4:1: Some will fall away from the truth.
2 Timothy 4:1: There is a judgement seat in the future when Christ returns, and salvation is not automatic.
1 Corinthians 4:4-5: we need to await the outcome of the judgement.
Matthew 7:21: Many will be rejected.
2 Timothy 4:6-7: Paul had been faithful, and note this is also an inspired comment.
2 Timothy 4:8: Paul recognises Jesus as a righteous judge, and that as a result he will be given the reward of everlasting life. Those also that love the return of Jesus, the appearing when he comes to establish the kingdom and reward the faithful will also receive everlasting life.
2 Timothy 4:10: For one reason or another, possibly the stress of the situation caused Demas to fail, his love waxed cold and he turned again to the world, even loved this world.
Kind regards
Trevor
I need to apologise for my statements, partly I could have misunderstood what you were asking. Either an indirect answer or a breaking down of whether OSAS is correct and also the word you used "love", is seen in the following:You need say no more, you are just not going to answer and I understand why. Giving a moral scolding on your superior understanding of God is not necessary.
Matthew 24:12: Under severe trial many will fall away.
1 Corinthians 9:26-27: The fight against sin is ongoing, with the possibility of rejection if we fail, if our love for the things of God becomes dull and ineffectual.
1 Timothy 4:1: Some will fall away from the truth.
2 Timothy 4:1: There is a judgement seat in the future when Christ returns, and salvation is not automatic.
1 Corinthians 4:4-5: we need to await the outcome of the judgement.
Matthew 7:21: Many will be rejected.
2 Timothy 4:6-7: Paul had been faithful, and note this is also an inspired comment.
2 Timothy 4:8: Paul recognises Jesus as a righteous judge, and that as a result he will be given the reward of everlasting life. Those also that love the return of Jesus, the appearing when he comes to establish the kingdom and reward the faithful will also receive everlasting life.
2 Timothy 4:10: For one reason or another, possibly the stress of the situation caused Demas to fail, his love waxed cold and he turned again to the world, even loved this world.
Kind regards
Trevor
1
1Mind1Spirit
Guest
Paul had vowed a vow.Many Christians do go their own way. Paul "went his own way" when he was determined to go to Jerusalem even after being repeatedly warned by God not to go (Acts 20:22ff). It nearly cost him his life.
The Holy Spirit would not be warning him to break it.
King James Bible
When thou shalt vow a vow unto the LORD thy God, thou shalt not slack to pay it: for the LORD thy God will surely require it of thee; and it would be sin in thee.
S
shroom
Guest
Acts 20:23 Save that the Holy Ghost witnesseth in every city, saying that bonds and afflictions abide me.Paul had vowed a vow.
The Holy Spirit would not be warning him to break it.
King James Bible
When thou shalt vow a vow unto the LORD thy God, thou shalt not slack to pay it: for the LORD thy God will surely require it of thee; and it would be sin in thee.
Acts 21:4 And finding disciples, we tarried there seven days: who said to Paul through the Spirit, that he should not go up to Jerusalem.
Acts 21:9 And the same man had four daughters, virgins, which did prophesy. [I wonder what they prophesied...]
Acts 21:11 And when he [Agabus the prophet] was come unto us, he took Paul's girdle, and bound his own hands and feet, and said, Thus saith the Holy Ghost, So shall the Jews at Jerusalem bind the man that owneth this girdle, and shall deliver him into the hands of the Gentiles.
God did not want Paul to go to Jerusalem. He went anyway.
G
Grace Accepted
Guest
And then God kills them for eternity?Greetings again Grace Accepted,
I need to apologise for my statements, partly I could have misunderstood what you were asking. Either an indirect answer or a breaking down of whether OSAS is correct and also the word you used "love", is seen in the following:
Matthew 24:12: Under severe trial many will fall away.
1 Corinthians 9:26-27: The fight against sin is ongoing, with the possibility of rejection if we fail, if our love for the things of God becomes dull and ineffectual.
1 Timothy 4:1: Some will fall away from the truth.
2 Timothy 4:1: There is a judgement seat in the future when Christ returns, and salvation is not automatic.
1 Corinthians 4:4-5: we need to await the outcome of the judgement.
Matthew 7:21: Many will be rejected.
2 Timothy 4:6-7: Paul had been faithful, and note this is also an inspired comment.
2 Timothy 4:8: Paul recognises Jesus as a righteous judge, and that as a result he will be given the reward of everlasting life. Those also that love the return of Jesus, the appearing when he comes to establish the kingdom and reward the faithful will also receive everlasting life.
2 Timothy 4:10: For one reason or another, possibly the stress of the situation caused Demas to fail, his love waxed cold and he turned again to the world, even loved this world.
Kind regards
Trevor
T
TrevorL
Guest
Greetings again Grace Accepted,
Kind regards
Trevor
The rejected at the judgement seat will experience some suffering and later the second death. The majority of people are not subject to the judgement, but simply live their lives and die and return to the dust Genesis 3:19.And then God kills them for eternity?
Kind regards
Trevor
1
1Mind1Spirit
Guest
Meyer's NT CommentaryGod did not want Paul to go to Jerusalem. He went anyway.
Acts 21:4. Ἀνευρόντες] See on Luke 2:16. The Christians there (τοὺς μαθ.) were certainly only few (see Acts 11:19, Acts 15:3), so that they had to be sought out in the great city of Tyre. πάντων … τέκνοις, Acts 21:5, also points to a small number of Christians.
διὰ τοῦ πνεύματος] so that the Holy Spirit (speaking within them) was the mediating occasion. The Spirit had testified to them that a fate full of suffering awaited Paul in Jerusalem, and this in their loving zealous care they took as a valid warning to him not to go to Jerusalem. But Paul himself was more fully and correctly aware of the will of the Spirit; he was certain that, in spite of the bonds and sufferings which the Spirit made known to him from city to city, he must go to Jerusalem (Acts 20:22).