The Uncomfortable Question:Is God Really A Tyrant?

[Grace Accepted]

When you boil down most theologies it comes down to either obeying God or receiving some sort of eternal punishment ranging from eternal torment to eternal annihilation. In simple terms, it is obey or else.

On one hand we think of God as a loving father but what happens if you cross him? Some people view God as a love contractor. You love me and then I will love you back but if you do not love me I will punish you with an everlasting punishment. There are some pretty graphic details about this punishment in the bible included but not limited to their flesh rotting off their bodies while they are still standing along with their eyes and tongues. People being so distraught and afraid that they call for the rocks to fall upon them to hide them from God.

Now it is true that God gave them a choice, but what kind of choice was that. "Do it my way or rot while you are standing" Hmmm, paradise or rot? Rot or Paradise? --such a hard choice. Did God come to this earth to demand that we obey and we would get the carrot of His love but if we didn't we would get the stick of damnation? If that is the case, how is that love.

Those of you who are father's, can you imagine a scenario in which you would treat one of your children that way? If God is actually the way most theologies believe, then we are ultimately at the mercy of a tyrant who will only have things his way or else. A parent who only loves their kids if they are in compliance but hates them and will kill them if they do not comply would be deemed very dysfunctional.

I don't believe God is this way and i could go on to explain why, but I am wondering how others explain this first.

 

[Sissy]

I don't have a problem with God demanding it be His way or the highway.

When folks would complain about what a big ol' meanie God was at times, I would just reply with ....
"He's the biggest and baddest Leroy Brown in town, and you best not piss Him off!"

 

[Arial]

When you boil down most theologies it comes down to either obeying God or receiving some sort of eternal punishment ranging from eternal torment to eternal annihilation. In simple terms, it is obey or else.

On one hand we think of God as a loving father but what happens if you cross him? Some people view God as a love contractor. You love me and then I will love you back but if you do not love me I will punish you with an everlasting punishment. There are some pretty graphic details about this punishment in the bible included but not limited to their flesh rotting off their bodies while they are still standing along with their eyes and tongues. People being so distraught and afraid that they call for the rocks to fall upon them to hide them from God.

Now it is true that God gave them a choice, but what kind of choice was that. "Do it my way or rot while you are standing" Hmmm, paradise or rot? Rot or Paradise? --such a hard choice. Did God come to this earth to demand that we obey and we would get the carrot of His love but if we didn't we would get the stick of damnation? If that is the case, how is that love.

Those of you who are father's, can you imagine a scenario in which you would treat one of your children that way? If God is actually the way most theologies believe, then we are ultimately at the mercy of a tyrant who will only have things his way or else. A parent who only loves their kids if they are in compliance but hates them and will kill them if they do not comply would be deemed very dysfunctional.

I don't believe God is this way and i could go on to explain why, but I am wondering how others explain this first.

God hates sin. Nothing in His nature allows otherwise. He created us. He created a perfect place for us to live. Gave us dominion over this creation to care for it. Lived with us in this paradise. We are the crowning glory of His creation because we are made in His image and likeness. We are to reflect then, HIs holiness, His love, kindness, patience----all His moral character. When we fell from this grace, the worst thing that ever happened to us is when He turned us over to our passions and desires. He is patient and longsuffering in this, not striking us all dead on the spot. And in His patience and longsuffering and mercy He worked a plan of redemption from our treachery.

Only in Christ is this redemptive mercy found. Only in Christ is He our Father and we His children. Here, in Christ are we safe from a God angry and all powerful in that anger, against wickedness, the fury of His consuming fire. In Christ is where the love of God is found, and here where He deals with us as His children. Because it is only in Christ that we are seen as righteous, and are being made truly righteous. I love a God who hates evil and is powerful enough and loving enough to destroy it, that I might live in peace, and be for Him who I ought to be.

 

[freelight]

When you boil down most theologies it comes down to either obeying God or receiving some sort of eternal punishment ranging from eternal torment to eternal annihilation. In simple terms, it is obey or else.

On one hand we think of God as a loving father but what happens if you cross him? Some people view God as a love contractor. You love me and then I will love you back but if you do not love me I will punish you with an everlasting punishment. There are some pretty graphic details about this punishment in the bible included but not limited to their flesh rotting off their bodies while they are still standing along with their eyes and tongues. People being so distraught and afraid that they call for the rocks to fall upon them to hide them from God.

Now it is true that God gave them a choice, but what kind of choice was that. "Do it my way or rot while you are standing" Hmmm, paradise or rot? Rot or Paradise? --such a hard choice. Did God come to this earth to demand that we obey and we would get the carrot of His love but if we didn't we would get the stick of damnation? If that is the case, how is that love.

Those of you who are father's, can you imagine a scenario in which you would treat one of your children that way? If God is actually the way most theologies believe, then we are ultimately at the mercy of a tyrant who will only have things his way or else. A parent who only loves their kids if they are in compliance but hates them and will kill them if they do not comply would be deemed very dysfunctional.

I don't believe God is this way and i could go on to explain why, but I am wondering how others explain this first.

Unfortunately many have fallen into the trap of miconceiving 'God' as this as taught by some preachers or religious belief-systems going on about eternal hellfire, ECT and all that horrible stuff imposed by so called 'God'. Love by its very nature is not that way, and the Heavenly Father's love must be far greater than any good earthly father's love for his children, as that BEING is the utter essence of PURE LOVE. Love's will always gives life, supports, upholds, values, cherishes its beloved and will do all by its nature and being to continue doing that, because this love is eternal, and INFINITE. - this is why the ultimate realization and embrace of love via forgiveness IS salvation.


----------------o

 

[Studyman]

I don't have a problem with God demanding it be His way or the highway.

When folks would complain about what a big ol' meanie God was at times, I would just reply with ....
"He's the biggest and baddest Leroy Brown in town, and you best not piss Him off!"

Great response.

Heb. 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

29 For our God is a consuming fire.

Amen Sissy!

 

[freelight]

I don't have a problem with God demanding it be His way or the highway.

When folks would complain about what a big ol' meanie God was at times, I would just reply with ....
"He's the biggest and baddest Leroy Brown in town, and you best not piss Him off!"

Problem there is this 'god' being referred to or assumed may not even be 'God' in reality, but a caricature, image or some misconceived personification of Deity..... - so, it may be well to see if this 'God' is real, having all the actual qualities of divinity as being true 'Deity',.....and not just a religious image of 'God' created by any one given tradition, cult or school of thought. This applies to all people considering 'God' of course, so its blanket application covers all

A 'God' imposing an eternal sentence of ENDLESS TORMENT on sentient beings in 'eternal hellfire'..... allowing no escape, rescure or reform (rehabilitation) for such souls in would indeed be a TYRANT or something far worse. Sadly some professors have given this presentation of 'God' to the detriment of their hearers, inspiring only fear, and NOT love.


---------------o

 

[Grace Accepted]

Unfortunately many have fallen into the trap of miconceiving 'God' as this as taught by some preachers or religious belief-systems going on about eternal hellfire, ECT and all that horrible stuff imposed by so called 'God'. Love by its very nature is not that way, and the Heavenly Father's love must be far greater than any good earthly father's love for his children, as that BEING is the utter essence of PURE LOVE. Love's will always gives life, supports, upholds, values, cherishes its beloved and will do all by its nature and being to continue doing that, because this love is eternal, and INFINITE. - this is why the ultimate realization and embrace of love via forgiveness IS salvation.


----------------o

But do we understand love. We are in a world where self is paramount. It is in all nature, and most human interactions. So what is pure love? Is it what I feel for a nice warm pizza? Or a nice warm woman? My friends? Is it a feeling at all?

 

[Ted T]

I don't believe God is this way and i could go on to explain why, but I am wondering how others explain this first.

This interpretation of the gospel story is a prime example of what is called "telling the story badly..."

The command to love supersedes the command to obey since love constrains obedience but one can obey for reasons not loving...

Since love, ie, true emotional bonding, cannot be elicited by a command, it can only be requested by a personal declaration of love from the lover, and must be accepted by the prospective lover to be fulfilled.

Thus the first proclamation of the gospel to every creature under heaven (ie, ever created), Col 1:23, had to be a proposal of a loving heavenly marriage with a full explanation of the value of accepting the proposal (election to salvation from any and all sin) and the natural and legal consequences of not accepting HIS proposal, (condemnation and damnation).

HE created every person in HIS image, ie, able to be a perfect Bride for HIM, with a free will and the equal ability and opportunity to put their faith in HIM as telling the truth in HIS proclamation of love and accepting HIS proposal OR to reject HIS proposal as the psychotic invention of a liar and a false god with no superior knowledge of the consequences of a free will decision.

HE did not order innocent people to marry HIM or love HIM.
HE did not command any innocent person to love HIM or to marry HIM.
Orders, laws and commands are given to those sinful already to open their eyes to their sin to bring them to repentance so as to restore their ability to choose to love:
Rom 3:20 Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the law. For the law merely brings awareness of sin.

1 Timothy 1:9 We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, etc, etc.

Sinners are under commands, but the innocent, those who had not committed to faith in HIM or against HIM (making them to be righteous or condemned in HIS sight) could never be under any command. to obey.

 

[Ted T]

God hates sin. Nothing in His nature allows otherwise. He created us. He created a perfect place for us to live.

So,
should I accept this means that you oo not share the current blasphemy that GOD does create sinners and sinful people by creating them on earth in Adam's lineage of sinfulness (whatever that means) so that they are estranged from HIM and unable to fulfill HIS purpose for them until HE intercedes for them in Christ...against scripture:
Isaiah 43:7, 21
7 "whom I created for my glory"
21 the people I formed for myself that they may proclaim my praise.
whereas created in sin means unable to fulfill HIS purpose....?

 

[Ted T]

A 'God' imposing an eternal sentence of ENDLESS TORMENT on sentient beings in 'eternal hellfire'..... allowing no escape, rescure or reform (rehabilitation) for such souls in would indeed be a TYRANT or something far worse.

The torment of hell is endless but they receive it by their sinning the unforgivable sin, not because HE tyrannically orders it to be eternal...

They can't be forgiven because:
- they made the decision to rebel against GOD's claims to Deity by their free will and a free will decision cannot be changed by anyone unless the person asks for it to be changed by an outside power..

- Once they rebelled they became enslaved by the addictive power of evil which destroyed their ability to seek true repentance. They were instantly and totally unable to repent of their evil and became committed fully to the belief they were right to rebel against this upstart liar and false god.

Their free will choice to rebuke HIM as a liar and a false god put themselves outside of HIS grace and mercy forever by repudiating HIM as their saviour and their addiction to evil rendered themselves to be totally incapable of ever changing their minds about HIM or seeking repentance.

These are the natural, not judicial, consequences HE warned them about but they knew better, eh?

 

[Arial]

So,
should I accept this means that you oo not share the current blasphemy that GOD does create sinners and sinful people by creating them on earth in Adam's lineage of sinfulness (whatever that means) so that they are estranged from HIM and unable to fulfill HIS purpose for them until HE intercedes for them in Christ...against scripture:
Isaiah 43:7, 21
7 "whom I created for my glory"
21 the people I formed for myself that they may proclaim my praise.
whereas created in sin means unable to fulfill HIS purpose....?

He didn't create us as sinners. We became sinners.

 

[7thMoon]

He didn't create us as sinners. We became sinners.

All are wrongdoers? I think not.
But he did create Satan automatically as a sinner.